The results of the white laser investigation

Raptor · 02-28-2005

I finally got around to tearing the motor out of the white laser that was such a big question a month or so ago. The one Charlie (TurboDomestics) bought from John of HORT fame.

The car was in pretty rough shape overall, the condition I am told was not due to HORT and after looking at it, I do believe them. They never had the engine out, but someone did at one point. The shortblock likely was re-ringed in some backyard mech's garage, the cylinders showed definate signs of it and the pistons were stock. The pan was dripping with excess RTV and every fastener holding the engine in place was mismatched SAE and Metric that never came on any DSM. Rusty castle nuts everywhere.

The timing covers came off and as expected, the balace shaft belt was torn up and the timing belt was slipping on the crank. These things were however not the cause of the failure rather they were byproducts of the frozen rear balance shaft (turned out to be bent). A little further into things found the piston remained in the same postion regardless of the crank postition. Broken rod. The valves somehow escaped any serious damage however so now the pan comes off and the destruction is obvious by the piles of scrap that emerge. The number one rod is in worse condition that I would have guessed, I will post pics later today. Impressive damage . The shortblock is definately scrap.

Now the interesting thing is that there was probably less than a quart of oil in the engine but it wasn't leaking anywhere seriously, it wasn't getting past the turbo seals and the engine wasn't burning any from the looks of it. Didn't go out the dipstick tube either. So I don't know where the oil went but it was definately gone, The rod that went was seriously over heated before it died and the rest were okay which makes me believe it probably had spun a bearing and lost it's oil supply. There were a few small oil leaks but nothing that should have dumped 4 quarts in 70 miles. The lack of oil and some above normal RPM driving probably accounts for the spun bearing and resulting rod failure. I can definately say this was not Johns fault, or Ryans fault (the timing belt didn't stand a chance). So that should end the speculation. It would be nice to know where the oil went if it was full when delivered. I will do what I can to post pics later.

john · 02-28-2005

I was amazed to hear this myself. The oil was full when delivered as that is what anyone would check first before selling a car. I am amazed the car did not burn/need even a half of a quart in the time I had the car. I wonder how everthing went so wrong, so quick. I cannot wait to see the pics. Thanks for checking it over Mike.

**JET** · 02-28-2005

So it definately is oil starvation. So how did it develop a massive oil leak from the time John drove it to the time it died?

Common places of massive oil loss: oil filter housing, oil drain plug or turbo line. There should be a large amount of oil on the car if any of that was the case though.

Raptor · 02-28-2005

None of the typical spots showed any signs of significant leaks. There were obvious slow leaks, but none that could ever dump 4 quarts in 70 miles. The engine compartment was pretty dirty, but not from oil, it wasn't on the hood or on any of the cross members, not coming from the crank seals at either end of the motor etc. The engine did get extremely hot, and with the low volume of oil in it now, it is possible that some of the leaks may be well hidden. Either way, that is the primary cause of the damage and considering the extent of it, I wouldn't say it was being driven in a gentle fasion, combine those things and the damage is impressive to say the least.

A//// Guy · 02-28-2005

That is very strange. Oil cant just disappear though, it had to have gone somewhere or it was mischecked? I don't know and Im not sure we will ever know if there are no visual signs of leakage.

Oh well, combining the bad rebuild from before with no oil can make bad things happen.

john · 02-28-2005

Definitly not mischecked. Any idiot can read a dipstick. I even taught my mom how to on the taurus. I gave him the car with the radiator fan not working properly. It was on a toggle and he was well aware of it. On the test drive, I told him twice to turn it on and I posted it in the for sale thread. He could have overheated it by forgetting to turn the fan on... he said the car did not overheat when it happened though.

A//// Guy · 02-28-2005

I know I know Im not blaming anyone its just a weird situation.

TurboDomestics · 03-02-2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by Carlos

Definitly not mischecked. Any idiot can read a dipstick. I even taught my mom how to on the taurus. I gave him the car with the radiator fan not working properly. It was on a toggle and he was well aware of it. On the test drive, I told him twice to turn it on and I posted it in the for sale thread. He could have overheated it by forgetting to turn the fan on... he said the car did not overheat when it happened though.

Well I know for sure that I had the fan on, because the guy that towed me home after 4 hours of sitting, asked me what that sound was and I went and turned it off, so yes I was well aware that it was on a toggle switch.
Im still curious as to where the oil went, but oh well, we may never know. anyways if anyones interested the car still doesnt drive (runs though!! thanks Mike!!). Now it has some transmission problem, I cant remember what it could have been, because Im (as some of you may have guessed) car dumb.

anyways, quick question Mike, is it possible for much else to go wrong with this car??

-Charlie

Raptor · 03-03-2005

Unfortunately, there is always more that can go wrong with it. I wouldn't expect it though. Once it is back driving again with all 5 gears, if it is maintained well and driven respectfully, it should last for years. The car overall is decent, needs a few things that are all on a nice list now, but I would stick with it, as the major things are pretty much taken care of.

For everyone that doesn't know. The car was running yesterday with a decent motor at which point we found that there is a bent or broken shift rail. It doesn't go into first or second. It will be fixed soon and hopefully that is the last of the issues for a while.

slowbubblecar · 03-03-2005

how did that happen?

A//// Guy · 03-03-2005

Do we want to know? heh...

Maybe when the engine seized rapidly? Or power shifting yay!

LightningGSX · 03-03-2005

TurboDomestics said he was having problems with 1 and 2 gear before the motor blew

tpunx99GSX · 03-03-2005

Congrats on the car running again.

john · 03-04-2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by EclipseTurbo

Do we want to know? heh...

Maybe when the engine seized rapidly? Or power shifting yay!

Engine did not seize completely. A rod was destroyed but the crank turns the other 3 pistons... All gears were fine except 4th had a weak synchro. So the rail or fork must have gone before the engine went...