Engine Clanking -WTF!!! - Page 5

**Kracka** · 08-20-2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by MustGoFaster

What are you guys speculating (Shane, Mo, Swanny) about? Pre ignition causing the valve to snap and dominate the shit out of everything it can? Seems relatively obvious to me that is was a random valve failure. Even more so after what he just posted.

I'm with this theory.

jhaan_dude · 08-20-2008

wow alex just had the same shit happen to his 1g last week, he was driving and BANG!!!

thats the last time it has run...kinda funny how it was the same thing...

turbotalon1g · 08-20-2008

^you sure?

**Halon** · 08-21-2008

I wouldn't think at 1/4 throttle, 3-4k RPM's, rush hour on Central kind of driving conditions, that my motor would detonate enough to cause something like this.

niterydr · 08-21-2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by MustGoFaster

What are you guys speculating (Shane, Mo, Swanny) about? Pre ignition causing the valve to snap and dominate the shit out of everything it can? Seems relatively obvious to me that this was a random valve failure. Even more so after what he just posted.

It was a theory, but thats why I ask which valves and springs first...

I've seen the stockers randomly fail, but aftermarket if it isn't caused by a foreign object, it usually is a tuning issue. To heavy of a spring on a stock valve can cause added stress at the base of the valve as well.

But Brandon answered my question before I had to ask the 2nd one. Tough break Brandon.

FattyBoomBatty · 08-21-2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by niterydr

Tough break Brandon.

What you did there. I see it.

**Shane@DBPerformance** · 08-21-2008

It's hard to tell from the pictures. I can't tell, if all that damage is from a shit load off beating from the valve or if that's melted alum from pre-ignition. Maybe it's obvious in person. I have only seen stock valves fail when a piston hit them from a broken timing belt or whatever and there usually isn't that wide spread of damage even with a broken valve in there, but usually when a timing belt breaks, the motor stops running pretty quick versus Halon's that might have kept running longer with the other 3 cylinders still fine.

My reasons for thinking pre-ignition was the hole in the center of the piston, which is a sign of it. What looks like melted alum all over the piston, head and spark plug, which can be pre-ign, but maybe it's just beat up metal and not melted. A melted valve that fell off, which can be from pre-ign. And I was thinking that maybe the pre-ign started and first thing to start melting was the spark plug, which caused the tach to start going wierd once the electrode melted to the ground strap, then things keep heating up and the valve and/or the piston failed soon after.

Regardless, I would get the fuel injectors tested before putting them in a new motor.

**Shane@DBPerformance** · 08-21-2008

Pre-ignition and detonation are two different things. Often them come hand in hand though with bad detonation causing pre-ignition to occur. But you can have a pre-ignition failure caused by something else.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Halon

I wouldn't think at 1/4 throttle, 3-4k RPM's, rush hour on Central kind of driving conditions, that my motor would detonate enough to cause something like this.

**Halon** · 08-21-2008

I will definately get the injectors looked at. I'm even thinking about switching injectors. FIC has a new style 1600cc injector that's supposed to be coming out that are ball & seat design, and should help improve idle a bit as well.

Thanks for everyones help and ideas!

**Goat Blower** · 08-21-2008

Just get them tested and balanced by that local guy. I can look up his number if you need it.

Speedfreak · 08-21-2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by ecoli

It's hard to tell from the pictures. I can't tell, if all that damage is from a shit load off beating from the valve or if that's melted alum from pre-ignition. Maybe it's obvious in person. I have only seen stock valves fail when a piston hit them from a broken timing belt or whatever and there usually isn't that wide spread of damage even with a broken valve in there, but usually when a timing belt breaks, the motor stops running pretty quick versus Halon's that might have kept running longer with the other 3 cylinders still fine.

My reasons for thinking pre-ignition was the hole in the center of the piston, which is a sign of it. What looks like melted alum all over the piston, head and spark plug, which can be pre-ign, but maybe it's just beat up metal and not melted. A melted valve that fell off, which can be from pre-ign. And I was thinking that maybe the pre-ign started and first thing to start melting was the spark plug, which caused the tach to start going wierd once the electrode melted to the ground strap, then things keep heating up and the valve and/or the piston failed soon after.

Regardless, I would get the fuel injectors tested before putting them in a new motor.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ecoli

Pre-ignition and detonation are two different things. Often them come hand in hand though with bad detonation causing pre-ignition to occur. But you can have a pre-ignition failure caused by something else.

Ditto^^.

That's why I just said it could just be from things being beaten up. But pre-ignition has a specific look, and the look of that beat up metal is close.

Brandon, did you ever have any overheating issues? And if so did you ever accidentally go WOT during any overheating episodes?

**Kracka** · 08-21-2008

Yes he did have a lot of over-heating issues in the past.

User Name · 08-21-2008

He had a hood scoop above the exh. mani. and a lower scoop grabbing air into the radiator. That thing still ran hot? Mind if I ask your fan setup?(just wondering)

Sucks that it happened right after you started posting up these vids and how sick it was looking to be.

**Kracka** · 08-21-2008

He had to do all that trying to get things to cool down. He eventually did get it taken care of I think.

A//// Guy · 08-21-2008

I believe that once he changed over to E85 the overheating wasnt as bad. 210 degree temps arent that hot though, Id say its well within normal range.

**Halon** · 08-21-2008

The car has always ran hot for some reason, ever since that one time in the Menard's parking lot (also the same exact time I switched to a different FMIC). No idea why. The fans are doing alright. The car stays cool at idle, it's when I start moving is when it heats up. I have been doing everything I can to keep it running cooler but it's still running hotter then I like. THe fans kick on at 200, but while driving, it is often at 210-220. I still haven't gotten that worked out. It drives me crazy.

A//// Guy · 08-21-2008

Dang that is pretty warm. Mine always ran hot too once I had a front mount, even with water wetter and straight distilled water, and two fans. I never could figure it out, and even though my AC worked, I always had to switch it off once the heat started climbing.

Pushit2.0 · 08-21-2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by Halon

... they start as 2 pieces and are then fused together some how to create a single valve..

fusion welding, the same thing they use to weld the exhaust wheel of a turbo to the shaft. Spin one part really fast then smash it into the other part that is not moving. It looks to me like the valve head smashing around caused all the damage. Flow testing the injectors is a good measure to take anyways.

~John

**Halon** · 08-22-2008

Big thanks to Brian for lending a helping hand for a little bit today. Got the oil pan off and the piston/rod out. There were some larger chunks in the oil pan, that's for sure. Also, we found what we believe is a broken off Oil Squirter laying in the oil pan as well. How many oil squirters are there supposed to be on each cylinder? We're unsure where it came from exactly.

Steve, where is the honing tool that you have? I could stop by your shop tomorrow and maybe grab it if you're going to have it there. The knicks in the cylinder are definately there, but I'd like to try and just hone it and see how it turns out.

Also I think we decided that I will be replacing all the rod bearings. I currently had King bearings in there, not sure what I'll use this time around.

GnArKiLl · 08-22-2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by Halon

Big thanks to Brian for lending a helping hand for a little bit today. Got the oil pan off and the piston/rod out. There were some larger chunks in the oil pan, that's for sure. Also, we found what we believe is a broken off Oil Squirter laying in the oil pan as well. How many oil squirters are there supposed to be on each cylinder? We're unsure where it came from exactly.

Steve, where is the honing tool that you have? I could stop by your shop tomorrow and maybe grab it if you're going to have it there. The knicks in the cylinder are definately there, but I'd like to try and just hone it and see how it turns out.

Also I think we decided that I will be replacing all the rod bearings. I currently had King bearings in there, not sure what I'll use this time around.

each cylinder has one oil squirter at the bottem