SMIC with big16g? - Page 2

HiImBrian · 06-01-2008

dsms come a little rich from the factory so actually turning up the boost 1 or 2 pounds wouldn't hurt anything.

And anthony, you don't think a fpr is needed running 1000cc injectors? I can't say I've done a ton of searching on the topic of fprs but I've heard from numerous people that it makes tuning a lot easier and a lot smoother even if you just have a single pump.

DSM_421 · 06-01-2008

I can't tell you a defenitive answer on that Brian, so I will just wait for Shane to chime in about it.

Kevin 1G Drummer · 06-01-2008

I'm running 1 255 fuel pump in my car, it was in there when I bought it. When I got it, it was overrunning the stock fpr, so I put in another stock fpr, and it was overrunning that one within a week. I put in an adjustable fpr, and haven't had a problem with it since. If you're only running a 190 pump you can usually get away with the stock fpr, but a 255 will almost always overrun it.

**Shane@DBPerformance** · 06-01-2008

I almost always run into knock with a 16G or bigger on a stock SMIC if we try to run much boost. 12-14psi usually works okay, but thats no fun. A bigger turbo will heatsoak an intercooler faster, because it flows more air, even though it might put out colder air at the same boost level. 550+cfms at 200 degrees is going to kill the intercooler faster than 405cfms at 205 degrees. A 14B is usually fine up to around 17psi on the stock SMIC on pump gas. On E85 or race gas, it all goes out the window. E85 cools like crazy and acts like you put an air-to-water intercooler on the car with an endless supply of ice. Drag cars that run straight E98 or methanol don't even need to use intercoolers at very high boost. Race gas can be very high octane and octane will greatly reduce the chance of knock from high intake temps. My wife ran 25+psi with 110 octane on the stock 14B with the stock SMIC with no fuel control and went 12s.

A Walbro 255 will usually overrun a stock FPR, but it usually isn't any problem at all to tune around it. I have never had a problem tuning a car with a Walbro 255 and stock FPR with SAFC, DSMLink or an AEM EMS. With 2 fuel pumps it will get too out of control. I run 1600s and a stock FPR on my 1G with EPROM tuning. An adjustable is definately nice and might make things easier to tune, but if you are on a budget at all, it is something that I would skip. With a true speed density setup like an AEM EMS or the way the stock Honda ECU work, then FPR overrun is pretty much a non issue as long as you base + boost isn't too high. I tune Hondas with FPR overrun all the time on Hondata/Crome/Neptune that have their base fuel pressure in the 50-60psi range and it is perfectly fine because of the way their stock ECU works.

It seems like a few year ago someone decided that a DSM couldn't run or tune halfway decent without an aftermarket AFPR. Even though for years before that we didn't have any problems. A lot of people on here know that I am one for running the correct parts and doing things right, but too often I see a fancy AFPR setup on a car that totally missed some other important part that actually makes a difference. A fuel pressure gauge though is one of the most useful gauges for tuning on the dyno though when things are acting wierd.

Bertrenolds5: What MAS do you have? The stock 14B will max out that stock MAS and make anything else you do as far as tuning worthless.

bertrenolds5 · 06-01-2008

I don't know if I wanna mess with a safc, they always need to be adjusted all the time right? So I will probably just start collecting parts and then buy dsm link possibly.

HiImBrian · 06-01-2008

an safc does not need to be constantly adjusted. I'm sure shane will chime in again considering he's the tuning god. An safc is just like dsmlink, set it once and leave it. The only advantage link has is that you can adjust much more than just fuel and whatnot like an safc. I am not saying don't get dsmlink, I'm just saying if you're on a budget safc would be fine.

**Shane@DBPerformance** · 06-01-2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by bertrenolds5

I don't know if I wanna mess with a safc, they always need to be adjusted all the time right? So I will probably just start collecting parts and then buy dsm link possibly.

DSMLink is way better, but an SAFC doesn't always need to be adjusted. A/Fs, EGTs, knock resistance, whatever will change a little from day to day, weather condition to weather condition, fillup to fillup, but the same will happen with every engine management. A little bit of change is normal and needs to be accounted for in the tuning.

I had a 16G 2G DSM that I built a FMIC for and tuned with an SAFC at Elite about 4 years ago on our dyno recently. Even I was a bit surprised when the WOT A/Fs were still perfectly fine. I cleaned up the part throttle a little bit, since the things we can do on our Dyno Dynamics are leaps and bounds above what we could do at the Dynojet at Elite. I tried tried to push the tune/boost a little more, but it just ended up knocking and I pretty much went back to how it was set before.

A cheap used SAFC and some 550cc injectors work great on most pump gas cars, but DSMLink is much more advanced and lets you run higher boost safely.

bertrenolds5 · 06-01-2008

I'm gonna save up and someday get dsm link. Until then I will just keep it stock and start aquiring parts.

HiImBrian · 06-02-2008

^spoken like a smart man haha. Take your time and don't blow it up

**scheides** · 06-02-2008

get your 14b maxed out before you go for a 16g. Get a used evo IX fuel pump ($50 or less), evo 560cc injectors ($150 or less), and a 2G MAS ($50 or less) and you will be in good shape. Install SAFC & MBC, and then bring it to shane for a quick, basic tune.

FMIC and THEN 16g, you will be making GOOD power for cheap. Heck, you could do all of this for under $1k if you shop around.